So much bashing, too little patience for me to properly address it. But, in short:
1) Selyse isn’t ill or unable to bear children. Shireen exists for one, and it’s been established that Selyse and Stannis just don’t have sex that often. It’s hard to get pregnant without sex. She also isn’t deranged, a superstitious religious fanatic who is on board with burning children sure, but not deranged. Either you are basing this on the show’s babies-preserved-in-glass-cases thing which is a show invention, or you’re just labeling any action you don’t agree with as deranged. Considering the parts about Elia and Dany, the latter seems more likely.
2) No, the description of Elia as mentally deranged could not be
argued.
The fact that you
randomly assumed she said or did nothing as her children, only one of
whom was actually with her, died is on you, not the character.
We have no idea what Elia did in that room but it’s a no brainer to know that she didn’t simply surrender Aegon to be killed. But she was facing Gregor
Clegane. What
could Elia do exactly in the face of the fucking Mountain? How could she have stopped him from getting to Aegon? Why are you
blaming the victim for not stopping her killer or not preventing the murder of her children, one of whom was in another room entirely? (And it was Elia who was raped – raped and murdered with her son’s blood still on Clegane’s hands, but all you got from that is that she is “cuckoo” for not doing something about it? My god.)
3) Elia had two children in two years before a third pregnancy was discouraged so the correct assessment is “unable to bear more children”. Trauma from birth can prevent a woman from having more children, and Aegon’s was described as a difficult birth. The situation was not made better
by the fact that Elia was not given much time to recuperate after
leaving her sickbed from Rhaenys’ birth. She was ill but her physical condition was certainly worsened by how close her pregnancies were.
by the time he married Elia, but it’s fact that he definitely stopped believing that and instead thought that Aegon was the prince who was promised, probably from the point of Aegon’s conception.
5) Nope, Dany is also not deranged despite the show’s best efforts to show her as such (and trust me, I did fall for the show’s ruse at one point, but then I read the books). She does take questionable actions which will only increase in TWOW with her embracing of “Fire and Blood” and “dragons plant no trees” driving her actions, but ultimately she is not going to follow in her father’s footsteps and descend into madness. Dany is poised to be one of the saviors of Westeros, not its destroyer.
6) Dany’s ability to bear children is actually unclear at this point. As for the Stallion who Mounts the World, it was a crone from the dosh khaleen who made that prophecy when Dany was already pregnant. There might be some connections in how Selyse and Dany display belief in prophecies but the context you’re referring to with “supporting their husbands as the subject of prophecy” is not there. If anything, the connection here is that the people they believed were the subject of each prophecy, aren’t. Stannis is not Azor Ahai no more than Rhaego was the Stallion Who Mounts the World.
Based on the true events that took place in The Kingdom of Dahomey, one of the most powerful West African states in the 18th and 19th centuries, The Woman Kingtells the story of Nanisca (Davis), general of the all-female military unit known as the Amazons, and her daughter Nawi (Nyong’o), who together fought the French and neighboring tribes who violated their honor, enslaved their people, and threatened to destroy everything they’ve lived for.
Putting aside the contradictory character motivation that would lead Aerys to simultaneously make Tywin’s daughter a princess but also spite him by depriving him of his heir, while giving Rhaegar everything he needs to plot Aerys’ own dethroning with Tywin’s help…. yes, Cersei probably would still convince Jaime to join the Kingsguard.
But when [Jaime] made a brief call at King’s Landing on his way back to Casterly Rock, chiefly to see his sister, Cersei
took him aside and whispered that Lord Tywin meant to marry him to Lysa
Tully, had gone so far as to invite Lord Hoster to the city to discuss
dower. But if Jaime took the white, he could be near her always.
That sense of possessiveness that drove Cersei to talk Jaime into joining the Kingsguard so that he could only be hers does not go away if she marries Rhaegar. After all, it has made itself known when she was all of ten in what she did to Melara Hetherspoon, at a time when Cersei still thought she would wed Rhaegar
You stupid girl, the queen thought, angry even now. Jaime does not even know you are alive. Back then her brother lived only for swords and dogs and horses… and for her, his twin.
Note the present tense Cersei uses here. She is still bristling two decades after killing Melara just because Melara had a crush on Jaime. Cersei was ten. She was enamored with the thought of marrying Rhaegar but her thoughts and actions still bespoke her possessiveness towards Jaime. The thing about Cersei’s relationship with Jaime is that Cersei saw it as something that transcends any other relationship. They were two halves of a whole. Jaime was her mirror image, a part of her. There was no contradiction in her head between her “love” for Rhaegar and her connection to Jaime. So I don’t see how wedding Rhaegar would have deterred Cersei from sabotaging Jaime’s betrothal to Lysa so she could keep him herself.
Of course, wedding Rhaegar also has nothing to do with Cersei’s other motivation in talking Jaime into joining the Kingsguard. This is where Cersei’s resentment over how different she and Jaime were treated and over Tywin’s rampant misogyny towards her manifest as well. Cersei deliberately took Tywin’s chosen golden heir from him, the heir she thinks this of.
“You are not your father. And Tywin always regarded Jaime as his rightful heir.”
“Jaime
… Jaime has taken vows. Jaime never thinks, he laughs at everything
and everyone and says whatever comes into his head. Jaime is a handsome
fool.”
That’s the heir Tywin favored over Cersei, Cersei who sees herself as the only true son Tywin ever had and who resents that he never recognized it. Talking Jaime into joining the Kingsguard wasn’t just about Cersei’s possessiveness of Jaime, it was also about punishing Tywin.
As for the question about Jaime cuckolding Rhaegar, that’s an interesting question. Jaime did admire Rhaegar so “horning” him might not come to him as easily as it did with Robert. However, OTL!Jaime’s idealization of Rhaegar was shaped by a few factors: it was a byproduct of Jaime’s idolization of Ser Arthur Dayne who held Rhaegar in high esteem himself, but it’s Jaime’s time in court with Aerys that really highlighted the contrast between the Mad King and his chivalrous heir who, at the time, had Tywin’s regard as well. The glaring difference between Aerys and Rhaegar could only endear the prince to everyone around who saw him as a definitive improvement on his unstable father. Jaime’s idealization is further exacerbated in current time by his deep sense of guilt over failing Rhaegar in not preventing Elia and the children’s deaths, and by his overwhelming hatred of Robert. But the truth of the matter is that Jaime didn’t really spend that much time with Rhaegar personally to really know him. Jaime was indoctrinated into the Kingsguard at Harrenhal, mere months before Rhaegar took off with Lyanna, and even those months were mostly spent with Jaime in King’s Landing, and Rhaegar on Dragonstone. In reality, Jaime idealized the idea of Rhaegar he had in his head rather than the actual man who he did not know.
But the idea of Rhaegar would fail in Jaime’s eyes just as it would in Cersei’s in this AU. His twin’s involvement would force a necessary divide between Jaime and Rhaegar, not just in the jealousy Jaime would inherently feel towards whoever married Cersei, but also in how Rhaegar’s treatment of Cersei would heavily influence Jaime’s opinion of him (because I don’t think that the mess at Harrenhal and Rhaegar’s subsequent disappearance with Lyanna would be prevented simply if Rhaegar married Cersei instead, because Rhaegar’s actions weren’t simply about Elia not being able to have a third kid in OTL. Call me a contrarian but I’m a strong proponent of the narrative not validating Cersei’s delusional claims that Rhaegar wouldn’t have needed Lyanna if he’d only married her instead of Elia, which smacks of a great deal of ableism, racism and victim-blaming. No, thank you). The tourney at Harrenhal would have a great influence on Jaime’s opinion of the crown prince. Jaime had no horse in the race at Harrenha in OTLl; he had no reason to care about Elia Martell, and usual Westerosi ableism and racism made it far easier to scapegoat Elia than to hold Rhaegar accountable for his actions whether at Harrenhal or after, hence Cersei, JonCon, Viserys and even Dany doing exactly that. Elia was collectively thought of as lacking in the eyes of many and thus received a great deal of the blame for what Rhaegar had done (it’s not for nothing that we keep hearing “if
only Rhaegar had married X, he wouldn’t have needed Lyanna”. X sometimes being Dany and sometimes being Cersei but the he implication remain the same – that the cause of the problem was Elia and her inability to provide something that Rhaegar needed rather than Rhaegar himself).
But when it’s his beloved sister and his family getting publicly humiliated in front of all of Westeros, don’t expect Jaime Lannister to still smell roses off Rhaegar after the latter publicly spurns his sister, the Light of the West and the most beautiful woman in Westeros in Jaime’s eyes, in favor of the “wild thing” that is Lyanna Stark. Jaime’s disillusionment in the court of the Mad King would absolutely include the silver prince in that context. In an unfortunate parallel, the tourney at Harrenhal would repeat history in having another Targaryen publicly shaming a Lannister lady (at even a wider scale than what Aerys did to Joanna considering the sheer number of nobles present in Harrenhal) and another insult added to the list of insults Tywin suffered. While Jaime might not care about the Lannister name the way Tywin did, Cersei’s shame, heartbreak and fury would certainly matter to him in light of how much he loved Cersei and was protective of her. And Cersei would be murderous with the insult, which is personal and political. For a woman who coveted power since she was little, having her political standing so publicly undermined would be intolerable, which is made worse by the risk of being set aside for Lyanna (especially if Cersei and Rhaegar are not yet wed by the time of the tourney) or having Lyanna formally installed as a royal mistress.
How the changes would affect the aftermath of the rebellion is a bit complicated and is heavily dependent on whether Rhaegar and Cersei were already married or not. But ultimately, if Rhaegar survives the rebellion and wins (that’s a very big if), his very public actions with Lyanna and how he handles Jon’s existence might lead to some variation of this.
It did not take [Robert]
long to start playing with [his widowed cousin] again. As soon as
Cersei closed her
eyes, the king would steal off to console the poor lonely creature. One
night she had Jaime follow him, to confirm her suspicions. When her
brother returned he asked her if she wanted Robert dead. “No,” she had
replied, “I want him horned.”
fun fact about the next avengers film being filmed in edinburgh: they’ve blocked off certain areas which is disrupting one specific postal van’s delivery route which is in turn leading to an awkward stand-off at the police station because Marvel Studios might be a billion dollar company but this man really wants to do his job and apparently interfering with the course of the Royal Mail technically counts as treason so they’re at a stalemate
this is the best thing i’ve heard all day
Scotland, everybody.
Who would win in a fight: a billion dollar superhero film franchise at the top of its game or one (1) Scottish mailman.
Sam speaks 